Student Loan Forgiveness - US

[Joey D]

What if we stopped thinking of universities or degrees being paid for by the government as a whole and instead looked at specific courses being funded. This is the first time this thought has occurred to me, so it could be a terrible one. Just thinking out loud.

While I like the idea and think it would benefit society as a whole, I would fear that it would become too much of a political tool and it would take approximately 12 seconds for some loudmouth conservative to say that it was government indoctrination. I mean, can you imagine a government-funded sociology course when modern Republicans are controlling it? Or hell, even a nursing course that deals with reproductive medicine?

 

[Exorcet]

Philosophy apparently isn't that bad of a degree:

Which College Degrees Get the Highest Salaries?

How do different college degrees compare for earning potential? This chart uses a data set from 1.2 million past students to compare 50 different majors.

www.visualcapitalist.com

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

While I like the idea and think it would benefit society as a whole, I would fear that it would become too much of a political tool and it would take approximately 12 seconds for some loudmouth conservative to say that it was government indoctrination. I mean, can you imagine a government-funded sociology course when modern Republicans are controlling it? Or hell, even a nursing course that deals with reproductive medicine?

Or a government funded theology course

 

[Danoff]

While I like the idea and think it would benefit society as a whole, I would fear that it would become too much of a political tool and it would take approximately 12 seconds for some loudmouth conservative to say that it was government indoctrination. I mean, can you imagine a government-funded sociology course when modern Republicans are controlling it? Or hell, even a nursing course that deals with reproductive medicine?

The same thing seems to apply to funding higher education as a whole, or specific degrees.

If you were to say, for example, that the government will fund all math, engineering, history, government, business, and law courses, and nothing else. No medicine. No mass communications. No even all science. I think what you would see is other degrees leveraging some of the courses from those that are covered in order to at least partially fund those degrees.

Or a government funded theology course

Theology essentially cannot make the list. But that kinda highlights why it's hard to just fund higher education as a whole.

 

[Joey D]

Philosophy apparently isn't that bad of a degree:

Which College Degrees Get the Highest Salaries?

How do different college degrees compare for earning potential? This chart uses a data set from 1.2 million past students to compare 50 different majors.

www.visualcapitalist.com

Pay wise, probably not. I would wager that a majority of those with that degree teach at universities and university professors make pretty money. It's the number of jobs that's the issue.

The same thing seems to apply to funding higher education as a whole, or specific degrees.

If you were to say, for example, that the government will fund all math, engineering, history, government, business, and law degrees, and nothing else. No medicine. No mass communications. No even all science. I think what you would see is other degrees leveraging some of the courses from those that are covered in order to at least partially fund those degrees.

Unfortunately, even that might be problematic since we have conservatives who dispute history, how the government functions, and laws. I absolutely would not what someone who believes in Trump's view of the law to teach future lawyers. Math might be pretty safe, but even some state governments seem to think math is pushing a "woke" agenda or whatever BS they're trying to trot out.

Ideally though, if we could get past the stupidity that is politicians and leave education to educators it would be a good idea.

 

[Danoff]

Unfortunately, even that might be problematic since we have conservatives who dispute history, how the government functions, and laws. I absolutely would not what someone who believes in Trump's view of the law to teach future lawyers. Math might be pretty safe, but even some state governments seem to think math is pushing a "woke" agenda or whatever BS they're trying to trot out.

Yea, but how much can you craft the existence of government policy around bad faith actors who make stuff up? For example, some people want no police. Other people want a completely useless border wall. Is there a good reason to make a decision about where and how the government gets involved in policing internally or policing borders just because some people will make stuff up about it and go on a borderline insane line of reasoning?

To the extent that there is a real argument here about government indoctrination, I think that argument flies in the face of all public education, including for children. But I don't think that argument should hinge on the unhinged, or it's probably not a good one.

 

[BloodRaven]

Oh but that's the clear implication in your post, 'I had to so you have to as well', you get onto the suffering in a minute.

Implication? I don't imply, I say. I say what I mean, and I mean what I say.

I've not got a degree, and I have zero, absolutely 100% zero issues with paying my (considerable) taxes to fund anyone that wants to take a degree or engage in higher education (vocational, scholarly, or otherwise).

Well I do have a problem with that. Paying taxes to fund someone else's life choices is something I REALLY don't like. Why should my taxes go to pay for someone else's mistakes/choices/stuff? I hate that there's a welfare system. That system just allows people to keep not working and be lazy and a drain on society, not a help. Getting off topic, I know.....whatever.

I grew up on a sink estate, with zero prospect of attending uni for a number of reasons, yet I would not for a second countenance anyone being unable to undertake higher education and do so without being saddled with impossible debt (for the capitalist in you, that's actually better for the economy as well).

As for defaulting to abuse, that says more than enough about your own insecurities rather than those of others.

I admit I had to look that one up, I'd never heard of a "sink estate". And that sucks. You didn't make the choice to grow up in that type of environment. But that doesn't mean you should be burdened with paying for someone else's dreams. Those are THEIR dreams, let them pay for them. IMO, allowing people to pay for other's dreams just contributes to a lazy society where people automatically assume others will pay for their dreams and wishes.

And abuse? Being called a pussy is being abusive? ****, that's a term of endearment where I'm from. I guess I just grew up in a much different era where being called names like that meant you were OK with someone. At my previous job, we called each other all kinds of names. And we all got along really well. We all knew it was in jest and could take it as well as we could dish it out. But I guess some people are thin-skinned. Whatever, I can't help that. Get thicker skin? And you may consider it abusive, but I don't. It's just how we talk, where I'm from.

Feelings are a real-world thing.

I know they are, but I don't allow them to run my life. If I get upset, I don't let it dictate my choices. I stop, calm myself, and think things through. But some people I know, personally, allow their lives to run totally on their feelings. And I've given them **** for it. One of them got a little upset with me about it. "Oh well. Maybe don't be an over-sensitive pussy" (my exact words to her). Too harsh? Maybe. But I don't care. It's how I am. I was raised to not let anyone walk all over me and to stand up for myself. If that made me abrasive, so be it. That's how I see the world. I don't see it as all rainbows and unicorns.

Yet here you are crying about others potentially getting an opportunity to not have it play out in the same way, sounds a lot like you do what for them to suffer the same, regardless of your claim otherwise.

What I'm "crying" about is people not having to (or wanting to) pay back a loan that they promised to pay back. And, yes, they promised when they signed that document stating that they would pay back the loan(s).

If you don't pay your car loan, they come and take your car away. If you don't pay your mortgage, they come and take your house from you, kick you out, and sell it to someone else. As for education, I think if you don't pay back your loans, and don't WANT to pay back your loans, then you should forfeit your degree. No payment, then you have no degree to use to get a better job. Want a better job? Then get a degree, pay for your loans, and show society that you're a responsible adult.

What was that about suffering again?

We all suffer. Some just handle it better than others. I've been without a home. I've been without a car. I've been without a job. I've been without food. But I did things to make sure that never happens again.

You are aware that the vast majority of people getting loan forgiveness are trying to do just that? You seem seriously removed from the actual facts involved.

Yes, I'm aware of that fact. But sometimes you have to take a job you really don't want in order to make ends meet. I don't want some of the jobs I've had. But I did them so I could pay my bills, including my student loans. I never asked for forgiveness. I never asked for help. I just did what I could to make sure I made those payments. I went without nice things for quite a while to make sure I paid back those loans.

Maybe it should be, a reason exists that the US falls so low down on every social and happiness measure around, and countries that operate on a socially inclusive basis outperform it on multiple measures.

And I give no ***** about either of those. I can't do anything about either of those. All I can do is try and control some things in my life, no one else's. I'm responsible for me, and that's it. I'm not responsible for anyone else. And no one else is responsible for me. I make my own decisions and deal with the outcomes.

You are aware that human beings are social animals? Your approach makes that a worse place to live, not a better one.

They may be social animals, but that doesn't mean you should spend every waking second with other people. I relish the times when I'm alone. I don't need other people to validate me or make me feel complete. And what I said still stands true. Feelings don't get the job done. Work gets the job done.





I understand that people need help from time to time. And it's OK to need help. Hell, it may be OK to even ask for help. But I'd rather just do it on my own. That way, I know it's been done and I didn't need a hand-out to get it done. IMO, a lot of these people wanting this loan forgiveness are those that just don't want to pay back their student loans. It's not that they're not capable of paying them back; they just don't want to do it because they don't want to do it. And to me, that's just pure laziness. And laziness never got anything done in this world. I can't abide lazy people and I refuse to put up with their ********.

 

[Scaff]

Implication? I don't imply, I say. I say what I mean, and I mean what I say.

And yet you did.

Well I do have a problem with that. Paying taxes to fund someone else's life choices is something I REALLY don't like. Why should my taxes go to pay for someone else's mistakes/choices/stuff? I hate that there's a welfare system. That system just allows people to keep not working and be lazy and a drain on society, not a help. Getting off topic, I know.....whatever.

No that system doesn’t do that at all, which us why countries that offer it have a higher standard of living.

Standard of Living by Country | Quality of Life by Country 2022

I admit I had to look that one up, I'd never heard of a "sink estate". And that sucks. You didn't make the choice to grow up in that type of environment. But that doesn't mean you should be burdened with paying for someone else's dreams. Those are THEIR dreams, let them pay for them. IMO, allowing people to pay for other's dreams just contributes to a lazy society where people automatically assume others will pay for their dreams and wishes.

It's not just their dreams, society doesn't work like that.

And abuse? Being called a pussy is being abusive? ****, that's a term of endearment where I'm from. I guess I just grew up in a much different era where being called names like that meant you were OK with someone. At my previous job, we called each other all kinds of names. And we all got along really well. We all knew it was in jest and could take it as well as we could dish it out. But I guess some people are thin-skinned. Whatever, I can't help that. Get thicker skin? And you may consider it abusive, but I don't. It's just how we talk, where I'm from.

As I said that says far more about you than you think, and I'm 51 so I'm from an era of ******** machismo.

I know they are, but I don't allow them to run my life. If I get upset, I don't let it dictate my choices. I stop, calm myself, and think things through. But some people I know, personally, allow their lives to run totally on their feelings. And I've given them **** for it. One of them got a little upset with me about it. "Oh well. Maybe don't be an over-sensitive pussy" (my exact words to her). Too harsh? Maybe. But I don't care. It's how I am. I was raised to not let anyone walk all over me and to stand up for myself. If that made me abrasive, so be it. That's how I see the world. I don't see it as all rainbows and unicorns.

Rather a sad outlook to have on life.

What I'm "crying" about is people not having to (or wanting to) pay back a loan that they promised to pay back. And, yes, they promised when they signed that document stating that they would pay back the loan(s).

Keep going, it's just reinforcing my point.

If you don't pay your car loan, they come and take your car away. If you don't pay your mortgage, they come and take your house from you, kick you out, and sell it to someone else. As for education, I think if you don't pay back your loans, and don't WANT to pay back your loans, then you should forfeit your degree. No payment, then you have no degree to use to get a better job. Want a better job? Then get a degree, pay for your loans, and show society that you're a responsible adult.

Apples and oranges.

We all suffer. Some just handle it better than others. I've been without a home. I've been without a car. I've been without a job. I've been without food. But I did things to make sure that never happens again.

Again, proving my point quite nicely.

Yes, I'm aware of that fact. But sometimes you have to take a job you really don't want in order to make ends meet. I don't want some of the jobs I've had. But I did them so I could pay my bills, including my student loans. I never asked for forgiveness. I never asked for help. I just did what I could to make sure I made those payments. I went without nice things for quite a while to make sure I paid back those loans.

And I give no ***** about either of those. I can't do anything about either of those. All I can do is try and control some things in my life, no one else's. I'm responsible for me, and that's it. I'm not responsible for anyone else. And no one else is responsible for me. I make my own decisions and deal with the outcomes.

Yes you can and society can do something about that, you just don't want to.

They may be social animals, but that doesn't mean you should spend every waking second with other people. I relish the times when I'm alone. I don't need other people to validate me or make me feel complete. And what I said still stands true. Feelings don't get the job done. Work gets the job done.

Once again apples and oranges.

I understand that people need help from time to time. And it's OK to need help. Hell, it may be OK to even ask for help. But I'd rather just do it on my own. That way, I know it's been done and I didn't need a hand-out to get it done. IMO, a lot of these people wanting this loan forgiveness are those that just don't want to pay back their student loans. It's not that they're not capable of paying them back; they just don't want to do it because they don't want to do it. And to me, that's just pure laziness. And laziness never got anything done in this world. I can't abide lazy people and I refuse to put up with their ********.

Again demonstrating a spectacular lack of understanding of the actual reality of the situation.

 

[McLaren]

I like the complete tone deaf of thinking, “I call people I know well enough insults bc I understand how they’ll react to it. Why can’t a complete stranger be the same.”

No wonder you’re clearly someone who thinks only about themselves. Your attitude just contributes so nicely to American selfishness.

 

[Danoff]

Paying taxes to fund someone else's life choices is something I REALLY don't like.

Taken generally, this statement seems to ignore that sometimes bad things happen to good people.

Taken more specifically, this statement seems to ignore that the US government is the holder of this particular debt. If the US government doesn't want it to be paid back, you're literally advocating for it to be held just to punish people for having taken it out.

Also, I see a lot of people who don't pay taxes complain about paying taxes. Are you one of them?

 

[BloodRaven]

Again demonstrating a spectacular lack of understanding of the actual reality of the situation.

All the other stuff notwithstanding, please explain to me so that I may understand. I'm open to learning new things.

BTW, you and I are the same age. Yes, we come from different backgrounds. And, obviously, different countries, but we were born in the same time and got to see the same things as we went along in this world. But they impacted us in different ways, as things do.

 

[Scaff]

All the other stuff notwithstanding, please explain to me so that I may understand. I'm open to learning new things.

Lets start with the fact that this isn't about people who picked the wrong degree and can't be bothered to pay it back.

BTW, you and I are the same age. Yes, we come from different backgrounds. And, obviously, different countries, but we were born in the same time and got to see the same things as we went along in this world. But they impacted us in different ways, as things do.

And I'm very glad I took the path I did.

 

[BloodRaven]

Lets start with the fact that this isn't about people who picked the wrong degree and can't be bothered to pay it back.

And I'm very glad I took the path I did.

Then what is it about?

 

[Scaff]

Then what is it about?

It's about an unbalanced and uncontrolled system that has devolved to the point that even if you do get a job it's biased so far against most that repaying your debt and living are almost impossible.

It's about a system that traps people in a cycle of debt that is, in many cases, unescapable. One exaggerated by an economic system that exacerbates that issue itself.

One that is so biased against people that even if the college goes bankrupt and you can't finish your degree you are still trapped with the debt.

This isn't about people trying to avoid commitment, it's about a system that has been allowed to make it spectacularly difficult to do so even if you want to.

Since you attended the increase has outstripped inflation by absurd amounts (much like house prices and rental costs), to be blunt it's unlikely you would, as a student right now, be able to repeat what you did 15 years ago. Go back further and that difference increases an even greater amount.

The rising toll of student debt: More than graduates can sustain?

Total student debt is now higher than credit card debt in the United States, and the numbers are growing quickly and steadily: our research shows that each graduating class has more debt than the class before. The COVID-19 pandemic threatens to increase debt to new heights. How much more can...

www.mckinsey.com

A broken higher education system is just one of the many economic and social failings the US has brought on itself.

 

[BloodRaven]

It's about an unbalanced and uncontrolled system that has devolved to the point that even if you do get a job it's biased so far against most that repaying your debt and living are almost impossible.

It's about a system that traps people in a cycle of debt that is, in many cases, unescapable. One exaggerated by an economic system that exacerbates that issue itself.

One that is so biased against people that even if the college goes bankrupt and you can't finish your degree you are still trapped with the debt.

This isn't about people trying to avoid commitment, it's about a system that has been allowed to make it spectacularly difficult to do so even if you want to.

Since you attended the increase has outstripped inflation by absurd amounts (much like house prices and rental costs), to be blunt it's unlikely you would, as a student right now, be able to repeat what you did 15 years ago. Go back further and that difference increases an even greater amount.

The rising toll of student debt: More than graduates can sustain?

Total student debt is now higher than credit card debt in the United States, and the numbers are growing quickly and steadily: our research shows that each graduating class has more debt than the class before. The COVID-19 pandemic threatens to increase debt to new heights. How much more can...

www.mckinsey.com

A broken higher education system is just one of the many economic and social failings the US has brought on itself.

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

 

[Exorcet]

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

It's not uncommon for people to care about people. I don't see why people would limit their concern to only what happens in their own country. It makes zero sense to me.

 

[NotThePrez]

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

Caring/being empathetic about what happens to other people, regardless of where they come from, is one component of basic human decency.

 

[TexRex]

lol

 

[UKMikey]

It's not uncommon for people to care about people. I don't see why people would limit their concern to only what happens in their own country. It makes zero sense to me.

Speaking personally... it's because we're goddamn pussies.

 

[TexRex]

****in' A, right!

 

[Scaff]

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

Because we all live on the same planet, because I have friends and family that live in the US, and simply because I care about people.

Valid question, but also a clear deflection.

 

[Populuxe]

I mean, the option is to not care about people, which would make me a sociopath, so... no?

 

[BloodRaven]

Because we all live on the same planet, because I have friends and family that live in the US, and simply because I care about people.

Valid question, but also a clear deflection.

Wasn't trying to deflect.

And I have no family in any other country. Hell, I have no family in any other state. My entire family lives within 45 minutes of each other. So I just find it difficult to care about what happens in another country when what happens in that country doesn't affect me in the least. So the education system in another country is worse than the one in which I live (speaking generally, not particularly about THIS country). I should be concerned about that? Why? It's not something I can fix or do anything about.

Some might say it makes me a bad person. So be it. I can't control what others think about me, nor do I care (outside of my family and true friends). I know nothing about the education system, the homelessness, the welfare, the social issues, or anything else in any other country. It's not something I can do anything about, nor is it anything that affects me, personally. So why should I worry about it?

Yes, people have said it's about decency. But it's not that I don't care about people. I just care about certain people (and, no, it's not just those that disagree with me). I'm of no importance to anyone and will do nothing important in my life that will impact anyone else. And I'm OK with that. And I have no quarrel with anyone who thinks that about me or holds me in a lower regard than someone else. That's their prerogative. I can't control the way people think or what they say. They're free to do both of those things.

But to me, it's just odd to care so much about what goes on in another country on the other side of the planet.

 

[FerrariF1GT]

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

Along what others have said, the current globalized economy means that what happens here in the US has an effect on the UK (and pretty much the rest of the world) and vice versa. Granted, the effects of international relations to the average joe are marginal compared to decisions made on the local level, but it’s very difficult to deny that globalization has changed many of our, and indeed pretty much everyone else on the planet’s, lives to some extent. Many non-American students attend American universities and vice versa, for instance, so education is just one of many ways American policies have effects on people around the world.

 

[BloodRaven]

Along what others have said, the current globalized economy means that what happens here in the US has an effect on the UK (and pretty much the rest of the world) and vice versa. Granted, the effects of international relations to the average joe are marginal compared to decisions made on the local level, but it’s very difficult to deny that globalization has changed many of our, and indeed pretty much everyone else on the planet’s, lives to some extent. Many non-American students attend American universities and vice versa, for instance, so education is just one of many ways American policies have effects on people around the world.

I guess I just prefer to live in my little bubble and not have to worry about things outside of my control. If I could, I'd move to the mountains and not talk to or interact with other people except maybe twice a month.

I'm not a smart person. And that's fine with me. I don't wish to be smart. There are much smarter people in this world who do things that I'll never understand on any level. And that's good. But I can't fathom what their lives are like doing monumental things that other people count on; some for their very survival. I know I couldn't handle that pressure. So I'm content with being who I am, not being someone others count on for important things. I'm the LAST person anyone should call for anything important or for any advice on any subject of real importance. And I'm OK with that. If we were all smart, and all the same, the world would be a very boring place.

 

[TB]

If we were all smart, and all the same, the world would be a very boring place.

I, for one, would LOVE if things were boring.

 

[Imari]

There are WAY more pussies now than there were then.

Having then clicked on your profile to check if you're the age you sound, you sure are. Finding it tough in an era where you can't just be a dick to everyone and have that deemed acceptable? It sure seems like you're getting pushback to your "I say and do what I want" attitude.

I don't care about your feelings.

We know.

It's called being an adult.

Actually, part of being an adult is developing some empathy and respect for other people. Children are the ones who are generally accepted as being selfish and self-centred, because they haven't yet learned the value of community.

I hate that there's a welfare system. That system just allows people to keep not working and be lazy and a drain on society, not a help.

Check out the guy who has never faced true hardship in his life.

Being called a pussy is being abusive? ****, that's a term of endearment where I'm from. I guess I just grew up in a much different era where being called names like that meant you were OK with someone.

No it isn't. You used it in a way that was definitely not a term of endearment. You mean that when you said "there are WAY more pussies now than there were then" you meant that there are way more people you're OK with now than then?

Pull the other one. It has bells on.

One of them got a little upset with me about it. "Oh well. Maybe don't be an over-sensitive pussy" (my exact words to her). Too harsh? Maybe. But I don't care. It's how I am. I was raised to not let anyone walk all over me and to stand up for myself.

You actually think being rude to other people counts as "not letting anyone walk all over you and standing up for yourself"?

Dude. What the ****. Do you actually accept that these other people are also humans? Or do you just have the world's worst case of Main Protagonist Syndrome?

I've been without a home. I've been without a car. I've been without a job. I've been without food.

This might be technically true, because it's probably technically true of just about everyone. People are between houses, between jobs, don't have a car for a while. That's just life, and it's not particularly unusual.

But I doubt it's even been true in a way that actually threatened your survival or you'd understand why welfare might be important.

And it's OK to need help. Hell, it may be OK to even ask for help.

No. You don't get to claim that you actually believe this after the last few posts of ranting about rugged individualism.

One thing that has been on my mind.....why does someone from England care about the education system, it's failings/shortcomings, or anything else that goes on in another country?

Serious question.

Apart from the fact that like it or not, America is seen as somewhat of a leader in the Western world, and so things that happen in legislation in the US are likely to at least provoke discussion and review in other countries?

So I just find it difficult to care about what happens in another country when what happens in that country doesn't affect me in the least.

Yeah, that's not how it works in most of the world. What goes on with our allies and the countries around us does actually have an effect.

There are probably things that go on in the world that affect you to, but you wouldn't know because you admit your own ignorance about anything outside your immediate sphere. You can't possibly know whether you're being affected or not if you don't know what's happening.

But it's not that I don't care about people.

Yeah, it is. You've made that pretty clear. You don't want to be involved with anything that isn't directly benefiting you.

I mean, the option is to not care about people, which would make me a sociopath, so... no?

Nah, it makes you a rugged individualist.

 

[TexRex]

Having then clicked on your profile to check if you're the age you sound, you sure are. Finding it tough in an era where you can't just be a dick to everyone and have that deemed acceptable? It sure seems like you're

I'm 50.

Okay so I'm also a dick, but I recognize that people generally don't like that I'm a dick and so I make a genuine effort to curb my nature. I also don't resent that having interactions with others frequently hinges on my making such an effort.

Honestly I'm surprised it took this one so long to find this subforum. This posted in "Words I Hate" in another subforum gave me a chuckle:

For me, I'm really starting to hate the word "systemic". Like.....REALLY hate it.

...

I mean I can't always curb my nature.

 

[Imari]

I'm 50.

It's more that there are age ranges where this stuff is more likely.

People of this type over about 60 probably aren't even self-aware enough to know that other people find their behaviour distressing, and they almost certainly don't care enough to go on little rants about it.
People of this type under about 30 are probably way, way more aggressive about the Cartman-esque "I do what I want" angle, and are unlikely to try and downplay with additional "but I do care about other people" rhetoric.

People of this type born in and around the 70s grew up in the tail end of an era where this behaviour was normal and expected, but that largely changed by the time they became adults. All of them are aware that social norms now aren't what they were then, but some adapted and some just got bitter that being wildly inconsiderate was no longer considered the other person's problem.

It's not that people who are 50 are automatically like this, most of them aren't. It's that when I see someone who behaves like this it's odds on that it's someone in their 40s or 50s, because selfish entitled ultra-right wing libertarian has a distinct flavour depending on the era in which it originated.

 

[TexRex]

It's more that there are age ranges where this stuff is more likely.

People of this type over about 60 probably aren't even self-aware enough to know that other people find their behaviour distressing, and they almost certainly don't care enough to go on little rants about it.
People of this type under about 30 are probably way, way more aggressive about the Cartman-esque "I do what I want" angle, and are unlikely to try and downplay with additional "but I do care about other people" rhetoric.

People of this type born in and around the 70s grew up in the tail end of an era where this behaviour was normal and expected, but that largely changed by the time they became adults. All of them are aware that social norms now aren't what they were then, but some adapted and some just got bitter that being wildly inconsiderate was no longer considered the other person's problem.

It's not that people who are 50 are automatically like this, most of them aren't. It's that when I see someone who behaves like this it's odds on that it's someone in their 40s or 50s, because selfish entitled ultra-right wing libertarian has a distinct flavour depending on the era in which it originated.

I had an idea what you meant.